Sometimes I want one too. I don't care if it's me saying it or someone else, but I really think people within evangelicalism and outsiders trying to understand are missing some of these connections.
They’re so important! And truly, I think the precise, EXACT way you explain and frame all of this is so, so needed. More voices certainly can’t hurt (and your posture towards that is part of the wisdom that imbues your work 💜) but I think you really have a gift for this.
Wow, I think another layer of the onion just fell off. My older brother severely abused me physically and emotionally my entire childhood. I don't ever remember a time when he didn't hit me. My parents spanked us, but they weren't extreme, they were casual Dobson readers, and we weren't constantly spanked. While I'll never know for sure, reading this, I am wondering if spanking played a role in showing him that violence was ok? I wonder if you explored sibling abuse in your research? I am not talking about sibling rivalry, I mean abuse. I'm sure it hasn't been studied because there just isn't a lot of sibling abuse research available generally, but I would love to know if there is a correlation. Thank you.
I believe you. I am so very sorry you endured this.
There is very little hard data on this sort of thing, not least because it's very difficult to define the scope and relies on self-reporting. I can say, anecdotally, that I heard from enough people saying how regularity and normalization of "spanking" led to spanking "games" and role playing that some identified as abuse that it makes me suspect there is a correlation. Whether these children would have abused other children without the spanking norms or not I don't know, but I think it's reasonable to think of how a sibling could justify themselves. So I do think there is a correlation there. I also think there is a correlation between children who were humiliated and dominated in various ways taking it out on other children - this seems evident even in the way some of the parenting experts who ardently defend these practices also recount childhoods that sound chaotic or abusive. If a child was feeling powerless and dominated it makes sense to me that they might then be aggressive toward a more powerless and vulnerable childhood, but I don't know - that's maybe more a question for a psychologist about how that might play out. Because of course millions of children were parented in this way but not all of them were abusing other children and not all of them repeat these practices as parents. I think generational and familial trauma is a significant piece of this but don't know how someone would get at that in a quantitative way.
Thank you, that makes a lot of sense. I appreciate you sharing what you heard in your research, what you think are likely correlations, and what isn't yet known. In my case, I think spanking was probably not the primary contributor, I think there were larger issues likely at play. But I just never considered it to be a factor at all until you wrote this, so I am very grateful. Thanks.
I first read about sibling abuse and the lack of research on the topic in Elaine Aron's book, The Highly Sensitive Person. I have been fascinated by it ever since. I'm not sure if that book would be helpful to you, but thought I would mention it just in case.
I'd like to offer a small critique of your article: it's written as if Evangelical parents were the only ones who spanked children. I didn't grow up in an Evangelical household, but I don't think I knew a single classmate in the 1960s that wasn't occasionally spanked at home. Even the school principal back then could administer corporal punishment. No one seriously considered any other parenting model prior to the Spock books (which were criticized by those who realized the good Dr. giving advice didn't have any children of his own).
You make some good points to consider, but I think there's a lot more to this story.
Thank you for sharing some of your experience! Agreed. Corporal punishment has been a mainstay of American culture for a long time—you can see evidence of it in our cartoons, literature, and, yes, going back a few generations in norms where any adult in authority could “spank” a child. In many cultures, especially during times when children were viewed as property, beating or whipping children was also a norm. Worth noting that there are exceptions to this.
My work specifically examines popular evangelical parenting advice which added to that norm—which was primarily tied to behavioristic conditioning—with rituals of spanking marketed as “godly” or “biblical.” This has led many evangelical families to continue to defend spanking in the face of the robust research we have that demonstrates harm, the accounts of adults reflecting back on egregious practices, and the consideration of the human rights of children.
I think there is a good deal of overlap and also there is something distinct going on in Christian communities that began with the launch of an exclusively Christian parenting media market circa 1970.
There have also always been people objecting to the corporal punishment of children. In fact, a number of Christians and pastors during the Victorian era took a non-CP approach, so while I think it’s for sure been the majority view in American history, there have been outliers and alternatives.
Thank you for writing this piece. The links between corporal punishment, sibling dynamics, deconstruction, and blind submission to authoritarianism are spot on. I'm sharing it with our community at Public Theology this month! (Also, your book is in my TBR stack, hoping to get to it soon!)
YES! Every new headline I’m like: there are so many layers here that connect to eva family life culture. Thank you for reading and for sharing! And I appreciate you reading our book - happy to connect further on it if you’d like to. M
That verse at the end just says it all. Stunned at how far from Christ 'Christianity' has been bent. Praying for a return to the straight but narrow path!
I want you to have a megaphone 🥲❤️🔥
Sometimes I want one too. I don't care if it's me saying it or someone else, but I really think people within evangelicalism and outsiders trying to understand are missing some of these connections.
They’re so important! And truly, I think the precise, EXACT way you explain and frame all of this is so, so needed. More voices certainly can’t hurt (and your posture towards that is part of the wisdom that imbues your work 💜) but I think you really have a gift for this.
Thank you for these kind words. 💜
Wow, I think another layer of the onion just fell off. My older brother severely abused me physically and emotionally my entire childhood. I don't ever remember a time when he didn't hit me. My parents spanked us, but they weren't extreme, they were casual Dobson readers, and we weren't constantly spanked. While I'll never know for sure, reading this, I am wondering if spanking played a role in showing him that violence was ok? I wonder if you explored sibling abuse in your research? I am not talking about sibling rivalry, I mean abuse. I'm sure it hasn't been studied because there just isn't a lot of sibling abuse research available generally, but I would love to know if there is a correlation. Thank you.
I believe you. I am so very sorry you endured this.
There is very little hard data on this sort of thing, not least because it's very difficult to define the scope and relies on self-reporting. I can say, anecdotally, that I heard from enough people saying how regularity and normalization of "spanking" led to spanking "games" and role playing that some identified as abuse that it makes me suspect there is a correlation. Whether these children would have abused other children without the spanking norms or not I don't know, but I think it's reasonable to think of how a sibling could justify themselves. So I do think there is a correlation there. I also think there is a correlation between children who were humiliated and dominated in various ways taking it out on other children - this seems evident even in the way some of the parenting experts who ardently defend these practices also recount childhoods that sound chaotic or abusive. If a child was feeling powerless and dominated it makes sense to me that they might then be aggressive toward a more powerless and vulnerable childhood, but I don't know - that's maybe more a question for a psychologist about how that might play out. Because of course millions of children were parented in this way but not all of them were abusing other children and not all of them repeat these practices as parents. I think generational and familial trauma is a significant piece of this but don't know how someone would get at that in a quantitative way.
Thank you, that makes a lot of sense. I appreciate you sharing what you heard in your research, what you think are likely correlations, and what isn't yet known. In my case, I think spanking was probably not the primary contributor, I think there were larger issues likely at play. But I just never considered it to be a factor at all until you wrote this, so I am very grateful. Thanks.
I first read about sibling abuse and the lack of research on the topic in Elaine Aron's book, The Highly Sensitive Person. I have been fascinated by it ever since. I'm not sure if that book would be helpful to you, but thought I would mention it just in case.
I'd like to offer a small critique of your article: it's written as if Evangelical parents were the only ones who spanked children. I didn't grow up in an Evangelical household, but I don't think I knew a single classmate in the 1960s that wasn't occasionally spanked at home. Even the school principal back then could administer corporal punishment. No one seriously considered any other parenting model prior to the Spock books (which were criticized by those who realized the good Dr. giving advice didn't have any children of his own).
You make some good points to consider, but I think there's a lot more to this story.
Thank you for sharing some of your experience! Agreed. Corporal punishment has been a mainstay of American culture for a long time—you can see evidence of it in our cartoons, literature, and, yes, going back a few generations in norms where any adult in authority could “spank” a child. In many cultures, especially during times when children were viewed as property, beating or whipping children was also a norm. Worth noting that there are exceptions to this.
My work specifically examines popular evangelical parenting advice which added to that norm—which was primarily tied to behavioristic conditioning—with rituals of spanking marketed as “godly” or “biblical.” This has led many evangelical families to continue to defend spanking in the face of the robust research we have that demonstrates harm, the accounts of adults reflecting back on egregious practices, and the consideration of the human rights of children.
I think there is a good deal of overlap and also there is something distinct going on in Christian communities that began with the launch of an exclusively Christian parenting media market circa 1970.
There have also always been people objecting to the corporal punishment of children. In fact, a number of Christians and pastors during the Victorian era took a non-CP approach, so while I think it’s for sure been the majority view in American history, there have been outliers and alternatives.
Thank you for writing this piece. The links between corporal punishment, sibling dynamics, deconstruction, and blind submission to authoritarianism are spot on. I'm sharing it with our community at Public Theology this month! (Also, your book is in my TBR stack, hoping to get to it soon!)
YES! Every new headline I’m like: there are so many layers here that connect to eva family life culture. Thank you for reading and for sharing! And I appreciate you reading our book - happy to connect further on it if you’d like to. M
Yes, I will follow up! Thanks for the offer. Looking forward to it.
Wow, profound, thank you for speaking raw truth on this topic so tragically normalized.
Thank you for reading!
That verse at the end just says it all. Stunned at how far from Christ 'Christianity' has been bent. Praying for a return to the straight but narrow path!
Thank you!
You are very welcome!
THIS. It's allllllll connected. 🫠
This is so profound and I'm grateful for you putting all the connections together for us!!